Spirits, Products, and Ingredients

Re: Abbott's Bitters Coming Soon?

jmrtnko — Sat, 18 May 2013 19:35:12 GMT

Adam George:
How long has TF held the trademark? Bob has been making his Abbott's for around three years, now.

Hmph. I was thininking the same thing about Bob's, but it's tricky. They applied but didn't follow through in 2007, then actually went through with it in 2009 and had it granted in 2011. As was mentioned, the original trademark was abandoned and expired in '86.

I've got nothing against TF, but this leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Trademarks are ultimately intended to protect a product. They protect you from someone else passing off a different (and assumed to be inferior) product as your own. For TF to be actively pursuing the original Abbott's trademark without putting out a product for six years just seems like trademark trolling. If you have no product, then there is no consumer confusion.

And to then turn around and hassle someone who has more likely a much, much closer recreation? Feh. I still don't like the idea of reviving the original packaging, but as suggested, the option that makes the most sense would be to join forces with TF - their trademark and production and Darcy's recipe.

Unless they have some actual connection to the original family and somehow unearthed the original recipe, I highly doubt they've put as much work into it as Darcy.

Re: Abbott's Bitters Coming Soon?

Adam George — Sat, 18 May 2013 15:51:37 GMT

How long has TF held the trademark?

Bob has been making his Abbott's for around three years, now.

Re: Abbott's Bitters Coming Soon?

Darcy S. O'Neil — Sat, 18 May 2013 12:38:04 GMT

I sent Bob, of Bob's Abbott's, an email and he responded saying Tempus Fugit has not contacted him at this point.

Re: Abbott's Bitters Coming Soon?

Adam George — Fri, 17 May 2013 23:57:05 GMT

Did anyone find out if Robert Petrie aka Bob had any such action threatened against him?

Re: Abbott's Bitters Coming Soon?

Calamityville — Fri, 17 May 2013 23:40:55 GMT

Regardless of what happens in the future, I'm hoping the two bottles I just ordered arrive soon and arrive with the Abbott's labels on them.

Re: Abbott's Bitters Coming Soon?

Darcy S. O'Neil — Fri, 17 May 2013 23:01:41 GMT

Oddly, there is a backup plan regarding the name, but it's not Costello's though i do like that.

Re: Abbott's Bitters Coming Soon?

Calamityville — Fri, 17 May 2013 22:52:59 GMT

Brilliant!

Re: Abbott's Bitters Coming Soon?

Dan Chadwick — Fri, 17 May 2013 22:49:49 GMT

You could call it Costello's Bitters and focus on the parts of the process that you enjoy. ;)

Re: Abbott's Bitters Coming Soon?

Darcy S. O'Neil — Fri, 17 May 2013 16:08:08 GMT

Thanks everyone. Unfortunately I haven't received a response from TF, regarding a seperate letter I sent, so I don't have any additional info to share, yet.

The key problem is that there will never be 100% certainty that we have the real Abbott's formula, though I feel my research has uncovered a few details, that I may share when the time is right, but a trademark discourages any future research and commercialization of the product(s). Basically, Abbott's research dies with the TF trademark. And so goes any further research on any product that may conflict with a company that decides to do an "end run" around copyright expirations using the trademark system.

And really, I have better things to do than fight legal battles over some relatively obscure bitters.

Re: Abbott's Bitters Coming Soon?

François Monti — Fri, 17 May 2013 15:22:36 GMT

I've got much respect for Darcy and I'm very sorry about the whole thing, but I actually fail to see what's wrong about TF reacton (or even how it is "bully behaviour"). It was to be expected and from a company in TF position, it was the only course of action. By the way, where are the lawyers? So far, none in sight. Let's hope good sense prevails and a solution, maybe along the lines mentioned by Dan, is reached. I had a chat about Abbott's last year with one of the TF guys and what I got from the conversation was that they had no intention of trying to prevent people like Bob to sell their version of the product, so I would guess, unless things changed, that the issue revolves around the formulation of the name and the logo.

Re: Abbott's Bitters Coming Soon?

Calamityville — Fri, 17 May 2013 15:05:53 GMT

I've written and sent my email to Mr. Troia.

I'm voting with my money. No more Tempus Fugit products for me.

Good Luck Darcy. I'll be placing my order soon.

Re: Abbott's Bitters Coming Soon?

Dan Chadwick — Fri, 17 May 2013 13:19:28 GMT

I am incompetent to form an impartial opinion of the merits of the legal conflict, but from a market perspective, I believe any legal conflict is likely to harm both parties, and by extension the craft cocktail community. These are both, I suspect, good people, with good intentions, that don't deserve the negative feelings that, say Puser's, Rogue, or Goslings have generated in the market by enforcing their trademarks.

Would our legal system allow TF to license (perhaps for $1) the trademark to Darcy for use on his (different) product? If so, this would seem to meet the objectives of all parties.

Re: Abbott's Bitters Coming Soon?

Kristian — Fri, 17 May 2013 04:50:02 GMT

Wow, I've been out of the loop for a long time! Multiple versions of Abbott's being produced? That's pretty exciting!

Just pre-ordered some of Darcy's bitters. Hopefully the legal issues will be resolved. I still have quite a bit of the real stuff left and it'll be a lot of fun comparing it to these new versions.

Re: Abbott's Bitters Coming Soon?

Robert Hess — Thu, 16 May 2013 18:02:46 GMT

For those of you perhaps not on facebook, there is an update to Darcy's "never ending saga" of Abbott's bitters here:

http://www.artofdrink.com/blog/tempus-fugits-cease-desist-abbotts

In a nutshell, the folks at Tempus Fugit Spirits, who are also coming out with an Abbott's bitters, and who have put up the website http://abbottsbitters.com/, have apparently registered the trademark for "Abbott's Bitters" and are now sending lawyers after anybody who is using that term on products they might be selling, or thinking of selling.

But read the details in Darcy's blog, and then feel free to tell the folks at Tempus Fugit Spirits what you think about it.(info@tfspirits.com) and cc darcy on it if you would like (dso@artofdrink.com).

-Robert

Re: Abbott's Bitters Coming Soon?

Darcy S. O'Neil — Sat, 20 Apr 2013 22:49:19 GMT

My research on Abbott's Bitters can now be found in the following slidecast. Lot's of good info for those who are curious about the history.

http://drnk.ca/xabbott